Fediverse

Ghostalmedia , (edited ) in Lemmy.world Should Defederate with Threads
@Ghostalmedia@lemmy.world avatar

Well, right now Meta is pushing, not pulling. Meaning, Threads content can be displayed on Masto, but not the other way around.

IMHO, the bigger threat is having Threads content completely dominate other activity pub clients. Other clients / communities could get dependent on it. Then Meta is basically a drug dealer with leverage.

Data collection doesn’t bother me too much. I’m not going to install their client and all of the behavior trackers that come with it, and my activity pub content is already freely available to query on the internet. If they want it, they already have access to it. Everyone does.

webjukebox ,

Data collection doesn’t bother me too much. I’m not going to install their client and all of the behavior trackers that come with it, and my activity pub content is already freely available to query on the internet. If they want it, they already have access to it. Everyone does.

I will be able to follow and see friends’ posts and sports teams’ posts through Mastodon without needing a Meta account nor install their shitty apps.

All I posted via fediverse is public already, traveling into some obscure instances, so I don’t care if Meta uses or shares my public posts.

Flax_vert ,

Honestly I like the ActivityPub idea. If ActivityPub becomes mainstream I am fleeing mainstream social media.

RobotToaster , (edited )
@RobotToaster@mander.xyz avatar

Since lemmy can’t pull from mastodon/threads, it seems like a complete non issue for now.

Ghostalmedia ,
@Ghostalmedia@lemmy.world avatar

Correct. This is an issue for Masto, not Lemmy. It may never be an issue for Lemmy for all we know. Lemmy is focused on following activity pub communities not individual people.

Marsupial ,
@Marsupial@quokk.au avatar

It’ll affect Kbin.

Draconic_NEO ,
@Draconic_NEO@lemmy.world avatar

No offense but Kbin users have a lot more to worry about than the threads issue, considering the amount of development and moderation problems that plague kbin to this day.

infinitepcg ,

Interesting. It seems that Lemmy can see Mastodon users and send private messages to them. And I believe Mastodon users can create Lemmy posts, so potentially Threads users could do that too once Meta enables two-way communication.

Microw ,

It all depends on how the Meta teams implements ActivityPub and which parts of it.

lil ,
@lil@lemy.lol avatar

Lemmy pull from mastodon if someone from mastodon mentions a user or community of lemmy instance

Rognaut ,

I like your perspective. More people need to realize that they are responsible for what they put out there.

AustralianSimon ,
@AustralianSimon@lemmy.world avatar

This, the real threat is the amount of content that federates out possibly hurting others servers’ performance as their enterprise kit will scale better.

PoolloverNathan ,
MostlyHarmless ,

This article is so misleading. XMPP died for the same reason all technology dies. No one used it. Even if Google hadn’t ever used it, it would still be dead. I know this because Google Talk and ALL Google chat apps are dead. WhatsApp killed them all.

Scrollone ,

In other words, Threads could help spreading the ActivityPub protocol more, not the other way around

Eldritch ,
@Eldritch@lemmy.world avatar

You are more correct than they are but are still wrong*. A lot of the interest in XMPP died after they started pursuing standardization and of course after Google close off their servers. It never had a ground swell before or after that either though. XMPP however, still exists to this day. And has become integrated into internet of things, protocols for communications between devices and as well as more comprehensive communication services such as SIP. They literally just had their 2023 Google summer of code complete a month or so ago?

But yeah XMPP is not dead. Unfortunately, it was a surpassed by a number of other services that offered more. Evolving faster than XMPP could while looking to become standardized. It only lost relevance to most. Not it’s life. For what it’s worth since 2000 or 2001, there’s hardly been a day that I have not been logged in to an XMPP server. I’m logged into one right now.

gruf ,
@gruf@lemmy.ml avatar

even if they are only “pushing”, there will still need to be profile data exchanged with Threads in order to access it, if they have http signatures enabled (i.e. authorized fetch under mastodon)

tigerjerusalem ,

Threads content completely dominate other activity pub clients. Other clients / communities could get dependent on it. Then Meta is basically a drug dealer with leverage.

How? Because this doesn’t make an yota of sense to me.

Flipboard federated. Are you flooded with news from them?

Maestro , (edited ) in Copyright statement on posts?
Maestro avatar

Federation means making copies. Hundreds of them. If you attach a copyright license to a comment then each and every instance that federates your comment would have to abide by it. That is just not possible. If you want to write stuff on the internet and copyright it, start a blog or something. By posting on the fediverse you implicitly allow copying.

ericjmorey ,
@ericjmorey@discuss.online avatar

If you don't post one, all copyrights are reserved by the author and is automatically granted upon publication in most jurisdictions around the world. So every federated instance is violating every copyright.

That is unless it's seen as fair use, in which case it doesn't matter what licensing the author wants to provide because the use is protected.

Maestro ,
Maestro avatar

You can't rely on fair use because fair use works differently around the world, if it exists at all.

As for copyright, you agree to terms & conditions when you sign up for your fediverse account. These should include language that grants permission to use everything you submit for federation.

ericjmorey , (edited )
@ericjmorey@discuss.online avatar

Instance hosters are currently relying on fair use since there's been no agreements when I've signed up.

Maestro ,
Maestro avatar

Maybe. I don't think anyone's thought that far ahead yet. At least the lemmy devs give hosters the option to add a click through agreement to the signup page.

FaceDeer , in Is there a good tool to transfer subscribed communities to a new account on a different instance?
FaceDeer avatar

There's an assumption in the comments that this is Lemmy-specific, so I figured I should also mention a tool I used recently when copying subscriptions from a kbin instance to an mbin instance.

ada , in Is there a good tool to transfer subscribed communities to a new account on a different instance?
@ada@lemmy.blahaj.zone avatar

Export/Import can be found in your profile settings

Nusm ,
@Nusm@yall.theatl.social avatar

Assuming your current instance is on 19.0 or higher, which most instances are now. If your on an instance that’s still running 18, it isn’t available.

LunchEnjoyer OP ,
@LunchEnjoyer@lemmy.world avatar

Ah, I only checked via Voyager app since I'm mostly browsing Lemmy via mobile. But then I'll find this later tonight in browser, thanks 😊

stevecrox , in What's going on with kbin.social?

The developer behind KBin seems to have issues delegating/accepting contributors.

If you look at the pull requests, most have been unreviewed for months and he tends to regularly push his branches once complete and just merge them in.

That behaviour drove the MBin fork, where 4-5 people were really keen to contribute but were frustrated.

To some extent that would be ok, its his project and if he doesn't want to encourage contributions that is his decision but...

KBin.social has gotten to the size where it really should have multiple admins (or a paid full time person). Which it doesn't have.

The developer has also told us he has gone through a divorce, moved into his own place, gotten a full time job and now had surgery.

Thats a lot for any normal person and he is going through that while trying to wear 2 hats (dev & ops) each of which would consume most of your free time.

Personally I moved to kbin.run which is run by one of the MBin devs

arquebus_x , in Dear server admins, please defederate threads.net. Dear users, ask your server admin to defederate threads.net.

If Kbin defederates from Threads, I'll just leave Kbin, and stay with Threads. Defederating over vibes is not how the fediverse is supposed to operate. And for everyone advocating for this dumb idea, I'm just using this thread as a honey pot.

squiblet , (edited )
@squiblet@kbin.social avatar

I’m pretty clear that meta has more problems than “vibes”.

sour ,
@sour@kbin.social avatar

fediverse isn't supposed to have most users concentrated in one instance also

Alto ,
@Alto@kbin.social avatar

No, the entire point is that you're free to go to whatever instance you want and/or host your own with your own rules. You're more than welcome to go to one that doesn't defederate, just as every instance owner/admins are free to defederate. It's not how "the fediverse is supposed to operate" because a standard for how the fediverse is supposed to operate doesn't exist.

Zorque ,

Bye felicia.

1984 ,
@1984@lemmy.today avatar

Big tech is a cancer on the internet. It makes sense to avoid it.

throws_lemy , (edited )
@throws_lemy@lemmy.nz avatar

Once they can interact with your account, they can pull your data into their server and analyzing it to deliver ads campaign.

https://lemmy.nz/pictrs/image/792f138a-e1a1-4ccb-b4fb-e68506723d1b.jpeg

KinNectar ,
@KinNectar@kbin.run avatar

They can already do this by hosting a small instance and going unnoticed.

narp ,

They can get the data, but they need the federation so people see their content/advertisement.

throws_lemy , (edited )
@throws_lemy@lemmy.nz avatar

And whenever an account from Threads upvote/ downvote or reply to your comments/posts or vice versa, Meta will analyze that and they can sell ads based on your political leanings, gender, geo-location, hobbies, marital status etc.

That’s the options from what I saw from fb ads dashboard years ago. If you’re from US, that options are broader and more detailed.

xigoi ,
@xigoi@lemmy.sdf.org avatar

How would they get the data? Federation doesn’t mean that they will get full access to your account.

Dieinahole ,

Please let the door hit you in the ass on the way out

Valmond ,

Bye then!

Here have a glass of boot juice for the voyage.

Fitik , in The international web standards organization W3C is no longer active on X/Twitter and has directed all their followers to Mastodon.

You might check out this - https://lemmyverse.net/communities

Fitik , in After Radio Silence, Kbin App Artemis Shuts Down

That's one more reason why open source is a way to go. You can never know if you'll get in a though life situation for example.

0x1C3B00DA , in Would it be great to post videos in peertube with lemmy/mastodon accounts
@0x1C3B00DA@kbin.social avatar

It's an explicit goal of ActivityPub, but mastodon implemented its own bespoke API instead of the ActivityPub Client to Server (C2S) API. Apps got developed for mastodon using its API and other services implemented the masto API instead of C2S to get app support.

And anytime you bring up C2S to current projects, they brush it off. So it seems like the grand idea of the fediverse is way far off and not likely to happen soon.

Fitik ,

Agree, C2S seems so cool, a shame nobody implemented it, at least I don't know any software that did

kbal , in Threads has hashtags now
kbal avatar

Unless there's bigger news you've not mentioned, this has nothing to do with the fediverse.

Chozo ,
@Chozo@kbin.social avatar

Threads is planning to federate, so it adopting more Fediverse-compatible features is relevant.

johntash ,

But this doesn’t look like it will be compatible with current ActivityPub, right?

Chozo ,
@Chozo@kbin.social avatar

I don't see why not. Mastodon could just translate multi-word hashtags into underscored hashtags. There's already some unsupported features from forks like Firefish that get translated, like emote-reactions register on Mastodon as favorites, etc.

0x1C3B00DA ,
@0x1C3B00DA@kbin.social avatar

ActivityPub can support tags with spaces, even though no fediverse platform allows you to write tags like that. The name of the tag can be pretty much whatever you want, as long as it has a valid URL.

cupcakezealot ,
@cupcakezealot@lemmy.blahaj.zone avatar

calckey can do multi word tags too

MargotRobbie , in Average Lemmy Active Users by Month
@MargotRobbie@lemmy.world avatar

What this shows us is that more people are joining lemmy, but even more people are either leaving or going into lurker mode, as Lemmy only counts people who have commented or posted in that time period as active users, whereas most social media counts any activity while logged in as active. You have to realize that people who use reddit as Google search results don’t usually interact with the content there and most won’t even make an account.

On the upside, with fewer people, it’s easy to get noticed here just by contributing good content since you don’t really get drowned out here because of the democratic upvote based sorting instead of black box personalized recommendation algorithms. So with relatively low amount of effort, you can make sure your content is being seen instead of relying on analytics and metrics.

The last thing to in mind that Lemmy is only one aspect of ActivityPub, and Mastodon’s growth is currently the highest right now because of the ecosystem created by the whale fall of Twitter, which indirectly grows Lemmy as Mastodon users can post directly to federated Lemmy communities.

pineapple_pizza ,

Do votes count as activity as well? Or just posts and comments?

meldrik ,
@meldrik@lemmy.wtf avatar

It really should.

Blaze ,
@Blaze@discuss.tchncs.de avatar

Strong agree

Coelacanth ,
@Coelacanth@feddit.nu avatar

I can see the arguments for both, to be honest. Ideally I’d like to be able to see statistics for both. Active Users and Active Contributors?

meldrik ,
@meldrik@lemmy.wtf avatar

You can already see how many posts and comments users make. Isn’t that the same?

Coelacanth ,
@Coelacanth@feddit.nu avatar

Well, as mentioned that is also covered by the Monthly Active Users metric that already is available. But in addition to that, I think it would be interesting to see the number of users who read and vote but don’t post or comment. Even though posting and commenting is the biggest part, actively voting is still an important part of the ecosystem.

meldrik ,
@meldrik@lemmy.wtf avatar

True, could be nice to see data on content consumers, and not just the content creators.

ComradePorkRoll ,

Agreed. Lurkers are what keep these sites alive.

Ategon , (edited )

I changed the algorithms in programming.dev to take into account voters in the activity. Since stats are all calculated locally you can view any community from programming.dev to get the monthly active users including that change

e.g. programming.dev/c/technology@lemmy.world shows 27.8k users/month on p.d which is almost as much as the value here for all of lemmy excluding voters

CommunityLinkFixer Bot ,

Hi there! Looks like you linked to a Lemmy community using a URL instead of its name, which doesn’t work well for people on different instances. Try fixing it like this: !technology

irreticent , (edited )

!vintageLA

*edit: so, that seems to not have worked in the Boost app. Is it a link for anyone else?

vintagela@lemmy.world

That doesn’t seem to make a hyperlink either.

/c/vintagela@lemmy.world

AnActOfCreation ,

All three of those work in Thunder!

irreticent ,

Thanks! I guess it’s just a bug in Boost.

meldrik ,
@meldrik@lemmy.wtf avatar

That’s crazy! User/month goes from only 7.5k active to 27.8k. And that’s just people voting. What about people who only read a post?

Ategon ,

Dont have access to those stats in the database so adding on voting is the best I can do

Theres a post read table but its only people who have explicitly marked something as read and is way less than the post likes

Deebster ,
@Deebster@programming.dev avatar

Do posts get marked as read when you read the comments? There’s the x new comments feature, so something must be storing that timestamp.

Ategon ,

I dug through the code and turns out the post read table does store when its read (with number of comments when it was read stored in a person post aggregates table), it just only stores it for people from your instance so I cant get accurate numbers from all of lemmy (and why it seemed like there was a low amount)

Die4Ever ,
@Die4Ever@programming.dev avatar

Votes unfortunately don’t count

omnissiah ,
@omnissiah@iusearchlinux.fyi avatar

There seemed to be an influx of reddit users but probably didn’t like Lemmy’s own distinct user base (*nix users for example)

I am kind of glad it settled down because I much prefer Lemmy over reddit

Dizzirron ,

[Thread, post or comment was deleted by the author]

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  • madcaesar ,

    What did you call me???

    Scribbd ,

    That you are a magnificent bastard!!

    fosforus ,

    People are way angrier here than in Reddit, because in Reddit, mods usually clean up the angriest people from the whole platform.

    corrupts_absolutely ,
    @corrupts_absolutely@sh.itjust.works avatar

    r/all is literally astroturfed hate every other post for multiple years at this point, and its not going to be moderated any time soon

    irreticent ,

    [Thread, post or comment was deleted by the author]

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  • demesisx ,
    @demesisx@infosec.pub avatar

    *dissent

    😉

    ComradePorkRoll ,

    We can be if it makes your experience better!! Watch!

    Dizzirron I bet you don’t even use Linux!

    corrupts_absolutely ,
    @corrupts_absolutely@sh.itjust.works avatar

    thanks margot robbie

    MargotRobbie , (edited )
    @MargotRobbie@lemmy.world avatar

    That’s esteemed Academy Award nominated character actress Margot Robbie to you!

    Boinkage ,

    Diane Diane what now??

    LostCat005 ,
    @LostCat005@lemmy.world avatar

    I just got recommended this site after posting on reddit re: predatory algos and the necessary regulations needed to protect people and how algos have manipulated the UX so much its disrupted the originally intended purposes; ie insta has effectively become a marketing and advertising platform.

    So in response someone suggested finding alternatives to the popular social media sites and used Lemmy as an example.

    I have been loving it thus far - its old school reddit.

    this is my first comment on lemmy!

    Enfors ,
    @Enfors@lemm.ee avatar

    Welcome! So far, in my experience, this is a much friendlier community that… many of the alternatives.

    CosmicCleric ,
    @CosmicCleric@lemmy.world avatar

    Welcome! So far, in my experience, this is a much friendlier community that… many of the alternatives.

    Usually. There’s definitely some who want to take their pound of flesh out of you when you disagree with them on something, but overall not so bad.

    SuckMyWang ,

    I disagree strongly with that opinion but respect you as a lemming

    CosmicCleric ,
    @CosmicCleric@lemmy.world avatar

    Fair enough. My perspective in the last day or two tells me otherwise, but I’m glad you’re having a great experience.

    irreticent ,

    There’re always going to be hotheads and bad faith actors in any platform, but I have noticed it is much more rare here on Lemmy. Much less vitriol as well.

    AmbientChaos ,

    Agreed on it being old school reddit! There are some UI wrappers that make it look and feel like old school reddit that I use and love you might enjoy. The wrapper is called mlmym and is open source. There are a few hosts you can use, I use this one: o.opnxng.com

    A direct link for your lemmy instance would be o.opnxng.com/lemmy.world

    github.com/rystaf/mlmym/tree/main

    LostCat005 ,
    @LostCat005@lemmy.world avatar

    OMG thank you so much! holy amazing.

    irreticent ,

    Check out https:old.lemmy.world for an old reddit lime experience.

    irreticent ,

    old.lemmy.world is like old reddit.

    Tetractys ,

    Fuck you! Hello.

    bobby295 ,

    Damn, I’d better keep commenting, I usually just lurk/vote

    some_guy ,

    Someone posted metrics for how many users vote. 131k.

    perviouslyiner ,

    halfyear includes people trying out different instances; monthly shows just the one(s) they settled on

    gmtom , in So today I finally deleted the bird app
    @gmtom@lemmy.world avatar

    I dont use twitter so I never understood the CSAM stuff. Did you follow accounts that post it or between it? Or does twitter have like a tiktok style for you page now and you get it recommended to you?

    ZILtoid1991 OP ,

    It was a bot on someone else's account, because we're at that point. It also had a link that I wouldn't even click if my life depended on it.

    Drinvictus , in Meta to close Threads in Turkey to comply with injunction prohibiting data sharing with Instagram

    It's so weird to see Turkey doing something right.

    WeLoveCastingSpellz ,

    Yea,as a turkish person I baffled at them doing something not terrible

    raspberriesareyummy , in Meta to close Threads in Turkey to comply with injunction prohibiting data sharing with Instagram

    Good. Fuck the Zuck

    haui_lemmy , in Meta to close Threads in Turkey to comply with injunction prohibiting data sharing with Instagram
    @haui_lemmy@lemmy.giftedmc.com avatar

    I‘m somewhat waiting for folks to pop up defending meta. Where are all the meta inclusionists and shills?

    electro1 ,
    @electro1@infosec.pub avatar

    As much as I hate seeing the web getting restricted and closed up, I'm not defending Meta, they deserve the worst fate that could happen to a Company : A Big lawsuit that puts them behind bars

    haui_lemmy ,
    @haui_lemmy@lemmy.giftedmc.com avatar

    I think we can do both. Hate the web getting closed up and hate meta at the same time. :D

    The interesting part is that meta among other trillion dollar companies is the reason why the web is this much closed up.

    tourist ,
    @tourist@lemmy.world avatar

    Zuck gave me CPR after I busted a nut so hard I passed out

    saved my life that day

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