This magazine is from a federated server and may be incomplete. Browse more on the original instance.

FaceDeer , in Three million malware-infected smart toothbrushes used in Swiss DDoS attacks — botnet causes millions of euros in damages avatar
Toes , avatar

That's funny, I was really wondering how many pwned toothbrushes there really could be.

morrowind , in TikTok Is Destroying Itself From the Inside Out avatar

Unfortunately, if twitter has shown us anything, it's social networks are ridiculously hard to destroy, even when actively self-sabotaging

negativeyoda ,

Instagram is absolute garbage compared to how it used to be. It's still massive. Once people are hooked, it's hard to wean them off. People were livid at reddit, but only a fraction of those who spoke up are here

Speculater ,

The average user doesn't even know anything happened.

dangblingus ,

API? That's like being gay or trans right?

loobkoob , avatar

What's changed about Instagram? I'm not familiar enough to know, but I don't feel like I've heard anything all that controversial about it outside of Meta's general "pay to remove ads" thing. I certainly haven't heard anything about systemic enshittification like I have with Twitter, Reddit and TikTok; have I missed anything?

Peppycito , avatar

It used to be you saw what you subscribed to. Now every third posted is suggested. Many of them have paid to be suggested, not even talking about the ads which seem like every other post. It used to be about pictures, now it's all reels, loud and obnoxious.

poppy , avatar

I know it doesn’t fix the fact the ruined main feed, but if you click on “Instagram” on the top left then select “Following” from the drop-down that appears, you will get a chronological feed of only the people you follow—no ads no suggested posts. Only reels if they were posted by someone you follow.

Peppycito , avatar

Right on! I never knew that!

poppy , avatar

They make it basically impossible to know about unless you are told. 😩

loobkoob , avatar

Ahh, that's the same path Facebook went down a decade ago then. Yay, capitalism...

Blisterexe , avatar

Instagram is not actually worse than before, sure, the content there is worse, but people spend more time on it, and as such it is doing its job as a social media platform well

ICastFist , avatar

I hate it that being successful and being a piece of shit are not mutually exclusive

Stern ,

They're hard to destroy until something (people view as) better shows up. My buddy Tom from MySpace got out while the getting was good.

sizzler ,

Digg on the other hand did not see it coming.

Stern ,

They were falling off as of V3, V4 deffo killed them off though.

Nowadays they're (kinda) back as a daily dose website.

andros_rex ,

God I miss pre-Digg Reddit.

stoly ,

You're back there now! Lemmy now is pretty much like Reddit pre-2008.

SaltyIceteaMaker , avatar

Well time to make a good open source alternative.

dakku ,

Some kind of federation

misk , avatar

TikTok is no more a social media platform than YouTube is. I'm puzzled why some people call it that and my only guess is that they've never used it.

SkyNTP , (edited )

"Social media" just means a public place where the plebs can upload content and interact with other plebs via the internet without knowing a lick of html, Internet culture, or anything technical really. If they are so lucky, some might even be graced by the attention of a minor internet celebrity, the modern day patricians.

misk , (edited ) avatar

I agree, it all went downhill when we stopped having liturgy exclusively in Ecclesiastical Latin. Plebs can now use internet without knowing HTML too. How will they know their place?

Honytawk ,

You mean the websites where people can be social around media ... is not a social media?

misk , (edited ) avatar

People seem to be selectively stretching definition of social media but are rather inconsistent in applying this label. Yeah, plenty of platforms and websites can be described as social media but we generally go with calling them by primary function. YouTube and TikTok are video platforms first. Reasons why Twitter and TikTok are going downhill are vastly different, reasons for their resilience or lack thereof will be very different too.

pineapplelover ,

It's hard because once you got a place where all your friends are, it will be extremely hard to leave because it's not like they'll follow you and move to something like mastadon, pixelfed, or lemmy.

My friends are on Instagram, if I wanted to find my classmates, they would all be on there. My parents are on facebook, there's no chance for those old guys to move to something else.

mkwarman , in Boeing, not Spirit, mis-installed piece that blew off Alaska MAX 9 jet, industry source says
Australis13 ,

Thanks for that. A very interesting read; I am inclined to believe the author, given how they describe the failure of processes.

ripcord ,

OP's article is really weird, too. It mentions "a source told the Seattle Times", but...they didn't. The Seattle Times was reporting on a purported whistleblower posting to a public forum (what you linked).

This site could have reported the same source. It's like they only skimmed the article they're regurgitating.

eRac ,

Also, the headline is completely wrong. The source claimed that a Spirit warranty team opted to go for a physically-impossible action and Boeing didn't stop them.

AnneBonny ,

It mentions “a source told the Seattle Times”, but…they didn’t. The Seattle Times was reporting on a purported whistleblower posting to a public forum (what you linked).

I think there are two sources.

The fuselage panel that blew off an Alaska Airlines jet earlier this month was removed for repair then reinstalled improperly by Boeing mechanics on the Renton final assembly line, a person familiar with the details of the work told The Seattle Times.
Last week, a different person — an anonymous whistleblower who appears to have access to Boeing’s manufacturing records of the work done assembling the specific Alaska Airlines jet that suffered the blowout — on an aviation website separately provided many additional details about how the door plug came to be removed and then mis-installed.

SnotFlickerman , (edited ) in Computer scientist shows how to tamper with Georgia voting machine, in election security trial: “All it takes is five seconds and a Bic pen.”

What's really sad is this is literally the same guy who proved the same thing in 2006. (I'm going on a limb and assuming this is the same J. Alex Halderman who wrote this paper at Princeton)

This has been an ongoing problem for almost twenty fucking years.

I went looking for this info because it spurred a memory. The "bic pen" was a part of this hack nearly 20 years ago, and the reference to it made me remember the original.

Fucking travesty.

MrZee , in Amazon sold a fake RTX 4090 FrankenGPU cobbled together using a 4080 GPU and board — scam card was found in a returns pallet deal avatar

Someone bought a pallet of returned products and found this as one of the returned products. So what?

It is important to note that this pretty useless concoction of non-working parts – dressed up as one of the best graphics cards available to consumers in 2024 – wasn’t sold as a new model. It was received by an NWR customer in a pallet deal from Amazon Returns.

We can’t know for sure, but the product received by NWR, apparently from an Amazon pallet deal, may have been an Amazon return where a faulty Franken-graphics-card was returned and someone kept a good working one. The outward description of a cracked PCB and melted power connector might even suggest another level of deception used to return this switched product.

Rentlar ,

Seems to me like either Amazon sold the scam product that the customer returned since it wasn't what they ordered, or the original customer did a switcheroo with some broken card. That would be the pertinent part of the story for me.

As far as the pallet buyer is concerned it's a swing and a miss and they probably should move on.

remotelove ,

It was likely return fraud and is super common with PC components. The logic is, is that your average customer service rep doesn't know how to correctly identify parts that are being returned and doesn't give a shit about the return as long as the customer doesn't throw a fit. I would imagine this is still the case with Amazon since there is little human interaction.

I worked with a kid at CompUSA who did that with GPUs. He got arrested, or at least, escorted out of the store in handcuffs. Back then, and I don't know about now, most retail stores had an RMA cage where one or two people worked comparing part number and serials for expensive part returns. When your name is on the receipt and you work at the same store, you are gonna have a bad time.

ZickZack , in The US is investigating if Boeing ensured a part that blew off a jet was made to design standards

Here is the more burning question: What is worse?
Case "It was not made to design standards":
Then boing might have a problem in their manufacturing processes, which is going to have ramifications on the entire fleet. This would be bad, but fixable.

Case "It was made to design standards":
In that case you only have a problem with this one type of jet, but you have a problem in your fundamental design, which might ground the entire fleet (again).

Kraven_the_Hunter , in Japanese disaster prevention X account can’t post anymore after hitting API limit - The issue has arisen after major Tsunami warnings have been issued in areas of Japan following a strong earthquake

Why governments would ever use a private service for critical use baffles me.

Create your own emergency notification system!

AbidanYre ,

Create your own emergency notification system!

Those never turn out well.

Running their own mastodon instance should be viable though.

otter , (edited ) avatar

I remember seeing that they did have a fediverse account? This seems related to that

Yup see here:

It’s also in the article linked above:

Luckily, the creators of the NERV App, Gehirn Inc, have created an app-based alternative for users to get information in real-time, as well as running a Mastodon account.

hansl ,

Is Mastodon even viable for time sensitive information? You need to wait for your instance to propagate the post from their instance which can take time.

AbidanYre ,

As opposed to waiting until next month for your API call limit to reset?

hansl ,

I’d suggest they join a system that has users, proper SLA and an open frontpage.

As much as you might like Mastodon for being open, there are no SLA between instances. Bluesky or Threads likely do.

Not saying they shouldn’t start their own Mastodon, but not for emergency and time sensitive things. Or just for people who can’t access those other services. More options also mean more reach.

Lumilias , avatar

They made their own:

Mane25 , (edited )

Is Twitter/X viable for that? They can decide, and have, to randomly put information behind login walls.

hansl ,

They technically still have an SLA, but it’s unclear how much they respect it. And if X isn’t viable there are other platforms that are.

Mane25 ,

SLA? If that means something like “service level agreement” (I don’t know, you didn’t specify, I’m guessing) then I can still find examples where it falls well below what I would expect from a public service such that if there was an agreement in place that I would definitely be opposed to it as a tax payer.

And if X isn’t viable there are other platforms that are.

I mean yes obviously, there are much more viable platforms like Mastodon, or even a self-hosted website.

hansl ,

And again, which was the point of my original comment, Mastodon may not do great when you need to propagate the post to other platforms. Unless you know something I don’t, Mastodon is horrible for time sensitive information, since it can take hours to get to your instance.

skillissuer , avatar

Just mass send SMSs in a given area

Brkdncr ,

The Los Angeles/ California earthquake alert system worked just fine today.

Flaky , avatar

Does that go through regular EAS? Wondering.

FWIW, Japan does have emergency alerts on iOS and Android, same thing as the Netherlands and the UK.

skillissuer , avatar

It's a secondary feature of a mysterious enterprise, unknown to americans, called "public media"

forty2 , (edited ) avatar

Remember when just about every government employee was carrying around a BlackBerry device for official business?

Pepperidge Farm remembers.

AbidanYre ,

I remember when they all loved the Nextel PTT phones.

BradleyUffner ,

That’s different. They had signed contacts and were legally obligated to provide service. Twitter is a free service that can be turned off at any time, with no notice, and is run by a schizophrenic twat with a god complex. It’s just monumentally stupid to put lives on the line through a service like that.

echo64 ,

They have one, but you also want information to be where people are. Especially if where people are is full of misinformation and rumours.

wandermind ,

Japan has various earthquake notification systems. Tweets are just one more way to get the information to the people on a platform they use.

Aopen ,

NERV isnt owned by gov and:

Luckily, the creators of the NERV App, Gehirn Inc, have created an app-based alternative for users to get information in real-time, as well as running a Mastodon account.

LemmyIsFantastic , (edited )

Because it’s often easier, cheaper, and more efficient in cases that mirror public needs. Alerting, SMS, cloud storage, all are solved and competitively priced. And don’t get me wrong, there ARE use cases for doing certain things custom or internally. There will need to be a mix of things.

The issue, is having an appropriate SLA and having the ability to hold companies accountable when it’s not met. You need stated provisions that won’t happen. Most commercial enterprises already operate under this model successfully, however many of the tools don’t have SLAs around an earth quake. Most companies are willing to provide those provisions but it totally will come with extra cost which is typically not budgeted or sales teams or contracting officers are not equipped to have these conversations.

Pacmanlives ,

Hate to say it but I would commonly get alerts from Twitter in the before times about local issues before I would get notified by my local government. Sadly they switched to encrypted radios so I can’t even keep up that way either these days

DoomsdaySprocket ,

This same issue happened during wildfire season in BC, Canada if I recall. A small polite media outrage over it, then forgotten.

Best case scenario would be an independent, international system developed within and for the emergency services community worldwide. Judging by the way firefighters travel internationally to fight forest fires worldwide, the community could be strong enough to support a solution like that, in my opinion.

quo ,

[Thread, post or comment was deleted by the author]

  • Loading...
  • DoomsdaySprocket ,

    For reference, the article I’m referring to:…/twitter-policy-change-hampers-drivebc-1.…

    “Social media’s reliability in emergencies questioned after Twitter limit blocks DriveBC posts” (Jul 12).

    Whether a provincial traffic account posting emergency info counts as news links for these large companies or not, it’s a pretty ugly look for them to have been blocking emergency information, and it doesn’t look any better now 6 months later.

    The whole thing is pretty typical (Canadian) government “not enough, and too late” -style regulation regardless, but these social media sites could think twice about playing the villain so readily in response.

    Australis13 , in Why a kilobyte is 1000 and not 1024 bytes

    This whole mess regularly frustrates me... why the units can't be used consistently?!

    The other peeve of mine with this debacle is that drive capacities using SI units do not use the full available address space (since it's binary). Is the difference between 250GB and 256GiB really used effectively for wear-levelling (which only applies to SSDs) or spare sectors?

    Lmaydev ,

    Power of 2 makes more sense to the computer. 1000 makes more sense to people.

    Australis13 ,

    Of course. The thing is, though, that if the units had been consistent to begin with, there wouldn't be anywhere near as much confusion. Most people would just accept MiB, GiB, etc. as the units on their storage devices. People already accept weird values for DVDs (~4.37GiB / 4.7GB), so if we had to use SI units then a 256GiB drive could be marketed as a ~275GB drive (obviously with the non-rounded value in the fine print, e.g. "Usable space approx. 274.8GB").

    wewbull ,

    They were consistent until around 2005 (it’s an estimate) when drives got large enough where the absolute difference between the two forms became significant. Before that everyone is computing used base 2 prefixes.

    I bet OP does too when talking about RAM.

    wischi OP ,

    It’s not as simple as that. A lot of “computer things” are not exact powers of two. A prominent example would be HDDs.

    Lmaydev , (edited )

    In terms of storage 1000 and 1024 take the same amount of bytes bits to represent. So from a computer point of view 1024 makes a lot more sense.

    It’s just a binary Vs decimal thing. 1000 is not nicely represented in binary the same as 1024 isn’t in decimal.

    Edit: was talking about storing the actual number.

    nous ,

    Huh? What does how a drive size is measured affect the available address space used at all? Drives are broken up into blocks, and each block is addressable. This is irrelevant of if you measure it in GB or GiB and does not change the address or block size. Hell, you have have a block size in binary units and the overall capacity in SI units and it does not matter - that is how it is typically done with typical block sizes being 512 bytes, or 4096 (4KiB).

    Or have anything to do with ware leveling at all? If you buy a 250GB SSD then you will be able to write 250GB to it - it will have some hidden capacity for ware-leveling, but that could be 10GB, 20GB, 50GB or any number they want. No relation to unit conversions at all.

    Australis13 ,

    Huh? What does how a drive size is measured affect the available address space used at all? Drives are broken up into blocks, and each block is addressable.

    Sorry, I probably wasn't clear. You're right that the units don't affect how the address space is used. My peeve is that because of marketing targeting nice round numbers, you end up with (for example) a 250GB drive that does not use the full address space available (since you necessarily have to address to up 256GiB). If the units had been consistent from the get-go, then I suspect the average drive would have just a bit more usable space available by default.

    My comment re wear-levelling was more to suggest that I didn't think the unused address space (in my example of 250GB vs 256GiB) could be excused by saying it was taken up by spare sectors.

    nous ,

    (for example) a 250GB drive that does not use the full address space available

    Current drives do not have different sized addressable spaces and a 256GiB drive does not use the full address space available. If it did then that would be the maximum size a drive could be. Yet we have 20TB+ drives and even those are no where near the address size limit of storage media.

    then I suspect the average drive would have just a bit more usable space available by default.

    The platter size might differ to get the same density and the costs would also likely be different. Likely resulting in a similar cost per GB, which is the number that generally matters more.

    My comment re wear-levelling was more to suggest that I didn’t think the unused address space (in my example of 250GB vs 256GiB) could be excused by saying it was taken up by spare sectors.

    There is a lot of unused address space - there is no need to come up with an excuse for it. It does not matter what size the drive is they all use the same number of bits for addressing the data.

    Address space is basically free, so not using it all does not matter. Putting in extra storage that can use the space does cost however. So there is no real relation between the address spaces and what space is on a drive and what space is accessible to the end user. So it makes no difference in what units you use to market the drives on.

    Instead the marketing has been incredibly consistent - way back to the early days. Physical storage has essentially always been labeled in SI units. There really is no marketing conspiracy here. It just that is they way it was always done. And why it was picked that way to begin with? Well, that was back in the day when binary units where not as common and physical storage never really fit the doubling pattern like other components like ram. You see all sorts of random sizes in early storage media so SI units I guess did not feel out of place.

    Hamartiogonic , avatar

    You know what else is frustrating? Time units. It’s like we’re back in the pre-SI days again. Try to compare the flow rates of two pumps when one is 123 m^3/h and the other is 1800 l/min. The French tried to fix this mess too while they were at it, but somehow we’re still stuck with this archaic mess.

    Vibi , in Best text to image generator

    My favorite has been locally hosting Automatic1111’s UI. The setup process was super easy and you can get great checkpoints and models on Civitai. This gives me complete control over the models and the generation process. I think it’s an expectation thing as well. Learning how to write the correct prompt, adjust the right settings for the loaded checkpoint, and running enough iterations to get what you’re looking for can take a bit of patience and time. It may be worth learning how the AI actually ‘draws’ things to adjust how you’re interacting with it and writing prompts. There’s actually A LOT of control you gain by locally hosting - controlNet, LORA, checkpoint merging, etc. Definitely look up guides on prompt writing and learn about weights, order, and how negative prompts actually influence generation.

    EdgeRunner ,

    Ive started with stablediffusion_webui, i feel you !!

    cyd , in Study shows AI image-generators being trained on explicit photos of children

    3200 images is 0.001% of the dataset in question, obviously sucked in by mistake. The problematic images ought to be removed from the dataset, but this does not “contaminate” models trained on the dataset in any plausible way.

    Fungah , in Study shows AI image-generators being trained on explicit photos of children

    Say it with me folks: regulatory capture.

    Google et Al wants to make it illegal for the average user to run any kind of ai model locally… it’s scaremongering.

    Even if po}pular image generation AIs did have images of children as part of their training dataset how many people would be able to have them generate anything even remotely like that?

    Big tech will use this research, and research like it, to de-democratize artificial intelligence and take it out of the hands of ordinary people while actual pedophiles are training image generation AIs on actual child sexual assault media.

    Sooner or later someone with a full blown cp generating stable diffusion model will be found and big tech is going to latch on to it like a lamprey on a shark, doing everything in their power to best the world over the head with it and ensure only they have the tools to make aim

    peopleproblems ,

    How? I can just go to civitai and download tons of models, clone the stable diffusion and lora tools, and buy better hardware now, and they’ll never be able to do shit about it.

    test113 ,

    I think he’s pointing out that in the future, this could lead to regulatory measures by the government because they get pressured by the big corps that AI locally is dangerous, but AI with big corps is all good and the right way. Which is an understandable concern. It’s not about you using whatever model you’re using; it’s about the broader philosophy of how AI should be integrated into our world. He’s saying the big corps are trying to monopolize the AI market, which is valid because that’s what’s happening right now.

    Fungah ,

    Yeah. You got it.

    And sure you can hop on vocitai and download a model or lora or lycoris or comfyui workflow or whatwver. But we’re only at the beginning stages of ai.

    Like. Face swapping is mainly done with with the inswapper. Onnx model which was pulled by insight face after it started making the rounds in the face swapping applicarion roop. It’s all well and good for hobbyist face swapping image gen but it’s a 128 bit model and low res. It kind of makes a blurry mess on larger images. Insight face has higher resolution models available but they’re not public, and to my knowledge there aren’t any viable alternative to this model that can match the same speed and accuracy. So everyone is out here playing with sticks and rocks while those who can pay have shoyn new things.

    There are very valid concerns about the harmful potential of deep fakes and I can understand how the models creator didn’t want to take responsibility for enabling that. But if, say, google wanted to use that or a similar closed source in house model to deep fake CASM for propaganda purposes or the same for political leaders, celebrities, not only does the public not have access to those models to understand how it’s being done and identify artifacts of that process, they lack the ability to “fight back” in any meaningful way.

    To be clear I don’t think the above is, or is inevitably going to happen, but it highlights the asymmetric nature of ai that big tech wants. It doesn’t even have to be such high stakes. If you wanted to, say, swap out your son’s face for Luke Skywalker on the star wars movie for a Christmas present or something, that’s something that would be challenging to do locally and convincingly without the right model, but not having access to that model you could instead be forced to pay an absurdly high price by a private company or denied entirely due to fear of copyright infringement, even though I’m relatively certain doing that and not releasing it publicly falls purely in the realm of fair use.

    And then there’s text, speech, audio generation. What happens if the tech gets good enough for someone to spend a few hours setting up some parameters for some pop songs with vocals, hits go, and generates music as consistently appealing as what we hear on the radio? And when no one else can access that tech? They’re able to pay artists nothing and basically produce free content wed have to pay for. If the public had access to that same tech then artists would still have a role in making popular music, even if the landscape had shifted totally. Either way the music business as we know it dies, but there’s one option where creative people can still make money independently without getting on big techs dick to do so.

    It’s a complicated issue and the ethics of it are fraught no matter where you look, but take one look at how cynically terrible all of googles products are getting and I think it’s painfully obvious we can’t trust them and their ilk with some access to this kind of tech.

    GBU_28 , (edited )

    I disagree. There’s huge money being pumped into the open source models space. These players are connected and wouldn’t bother if the writing was on the board room wall.

    Look at who finances “thebloke” on huggingface for example.

    theluddite , in 7.1 million miles, 3 minor injuries: Waymo’s safety data looks good avatar

    If those same miles had been driven by typical human drivers in the same cities, we would have expected around 13 injury crashes.

    I’m going to set aside my distrust at self reported safety statistics from tech companies for a sec to say two things:

    First, I don’t think that’s the right comparison. You need to compare them to taxis.

    Second, we need to know how often waymos employees intervene. From the NYT, cruise employed 1.5 staff-members per car, intervening to assist these not-so-self driving vehicles every 2.5 to 5 miles, making them actually less autonomous than regular cars.

    Source :…/cruise-general-motors-self-driving-…

    n2burns ,

    I agree that “autonomous” taxis need to be compared to professional drivers, and I’d even take it further by combining your two points. If they want to say “autonomous” vehicles are currently safer than professional drivers, they need a way to compare how many humans are involved too. I’m sure we could make conventional taxis safer too if they not only had a driver but a command centre where drivers are being observed and altered to dangerous situations!

    theluddite , avatar

    Yeah that’s a great point! Taxis also drive different kinds of miles than typical human drivers, who probably normally drive at rush hour when it’s more dangerous whereas I’d expect taxis to have disproportionately more miles during safer times.

    ZickZack ,

    First, I don’t think that’s the right comparison. You need to compare them to taxis.

    It's not just that, you generally have a significant distribution shift when comparing the self-drivers/driving assistants to normal humans. This is because people only use self-driving in situations where it has a chance of working, which is especially true with stuff like tesla's self-driving where ultimately people are not even going to start the autopilot when it gets tricky (nevermind intervening dynamically: they won't start it in the first place!)

    For instance, one of the most common confounding factors is the ratio of highway driving vs non-highway driving: Highways are inherently less accident prone since you don't have to deal with intersections, oncoming traffic, people merging in from every random house, or children chasing a ball into the street.
    Self-drivers tend to report a lot more highway traffic than ordinary drivers, due to how the availability of technology dictates where you end up measuring.
    You can correct for that by e.g. explicitly computing the likelihood p(accident|highway) and use a common p(highway) derived from the entire population of car traffic.

    onlinepersona , in Netflix Resumes Advertising on X After Elon Musk Controversy

    Capitalism. As soon as bad PR is over, it’s back to business.

    xantoxis ,

    When is his bad PR ever over?

    sukhmel ,

    When the cool down counter reduces to zero. He’s preparing the next bad PR though

    lando55 ,

    It has been 1 0 days since the last Elon PR disaster

    greencactus ,

    To defeat the Huns… But seriously, I am amazed at how quickly these changes go. It almost seems that they don’t really care about the impact of their actions ;)

    masterspace , in Discourse, the free forum platform, is now joining the Fediverse.

    eVeRYOnE defederate immediately! It will flood our community with new users and be awful!

    AustralianSimon , avatar


    subignition , in Omegle Was Forced to Shut Down by a Lawsuit From a Sexual Abuse Survivor
    subignition avatar
    1. I don't intend to victim blame or defend any abusers here; this shit is vile and should not be tolerated, period.

    2. From the below, it sounds like it was determined that, despite Omegle's moderation efforts, Omegle could have done better in areas relating to age verification and matchmaking. So I'm not trying to defend or minimize Omegle's role either, I don't know the details of how the site worked but it sounds like this was a problem for a long time:

    the judge in A.M.’s case found last July that Omegle’s design was at fault and it was not protected by Section 230: It could have worked to prevent matches between minors and adults before sexual content was even sent, the judge said.

    1. However, I really don't like the choice of phrasing "forced", and I wonder whether that's poor paraphrasing or actually taken from the lawsuit.

    Her lawsuit, filed in 2021, alleged that she met a man in his thirties on Omegle who forced her to take naked photos and videos over a three-year period. She was just 11 when it began in 2014.

    Again, to be clear, not trying to say that the victim should, or even could, have done anything differently. Victim blaming is bad. But how the hell are they saying "forced" to do something by some scumbag over the internet? What kind of conditions does a kid have to be in at home to feel like they can't turn to their parent/guardian for help in a terrifying situation like that? How is an 11-year-old in 2014 being allowed to get into that situation in the first place, between her parents and her school?

    It seems like this victim was failed by every support system she should have been able to rely on. This is so messed up. This is exactly why we need things like sex education and Internet safety education.

    WallEx ,

    So have you heard of emotional violence or exploitation? That’s how that works over the internet. You don’t need to be in the same room to be forced to do something if you’re vulnerable.

    elbarto777 ,

    OP addressed that already. OP is saying something akin to the following:

    “A kid wanders at night alone and gets into a run down bar. She gets groped. The police shuts down the bar, everyone applauds. But what is a kid doing wandering around at night unsupervised?! Where are the parents?”

    Jiggle_Physics ,

    This is a bad analogy, a child can’t wander into a shady bar, late at night, while at home, in their room, while doing what they can to hide their activities from their parents, in the way that they can going on an inappropriate website.

    mayoi ,

    If they’re going on inappropriate websites then that’s their problem. I’m sure any good parent would teach their kid about actions having consequences…

    I mean, realistically we all did, unless you grew up during time when there was no internet. My mother was concerned about it when she found out I had watched porn when I was 13, but nothing more. Funny thing is that my mother brough it up to my father and he was like yeah ok he’s a teenager. Lmao. But here I am today, I find porn extremely boring and didn’t watch it for over a decade, maybe I could have porn addiction if my parents decided to block internet over it instead.

    The thing online that traumatizes me the most is the thought that people turn off kid’s internet instead of teaching them how to deal with strangers properly, because believe it or not, outside world is a lot more scary than internet.

    A 11 year old can know to stop replying if someone asks their home address online, same kid can get kidnapped and have it be beaten out of them in the real world.

    Black_Gulaman , avatar

    Shield a kid from the horrors of the world, the you’ll have a dumb adult in he future.

    Teach your kids how to spot danger and how to handle all the world’s bullshit, then you’ll have a smart adult in the future.

    Don’t baby your kids please.

    Jiggle_Physics ,

    This does not get into the fine details of what happened. They could have had something going, deceitfully or not, that convinced them they had no other choice. Anyway, that wasn’t the point I was making. I was pointing out that a child sneaking away to a shady bar in the middle of the night has much more serious implications of negligence than a kid going to an inappropriate website.

    elbarto777 ,

    Bro. Analogies don’t need to be 100% realistic.

    How many analogies have you read involving fictional characters? Or saying stuff like “that’s a catch-22”? Do you say “actually, that phrase comes from a work of fiction, so it’s invalid”?

    “It’s like when Homer can’t stop eating donuts” - “Oh but Homer doesn’t exist. Checkmate!”

    An ant carrying a leave is like a dude carrying three cars on his back. “Whoa! It’s impossible for a dude to carry that much weight!”

    Jiggle_Physics ,

    Well, The shady bar thing has happened before. So it’s not unrealistic and that wasn’t my point anyway. It simply does not fit the situation provided in the way the poster is trying to use it. There are far, far, greater implications of negligence for a child sneaking away, to a shady bar, in the middle of the night, than there is with a kid going on an inappropriate website.

    phx ,

    Or even the opposite analogy. A guy goes to a bar that has an ID requirement. Has a few drinks. Meets a girl. They end up having a conversation and she and he hook up.

    A week later, the cops show and the guy is charged with a sex crime because the girl was under 18 even though:

    • By all appearances she was of a similar age to him and consenting
    • She was in a place where only adults would be expected to attend
    • The ID requirement of the establishment meant that she should have been well above 18

    So what’s the liability of the bar, both towards allowing underage patrons and allowing them to hook up with older individuals while potentially intoxicated? Could they be sued and/or shut down? How does that story change if the bar was known to look the other way on underage patrons, or not properly check ID? How about if the girl in question was known by some of the staff? How about if the man knew that underage patrons were not uncommon.

    Who has a case against the bar: the man; the girl or her parents; the police; or maybe all of them?

    Nobody should applaud an establishment working under the rules and doing their best being shut down, but when that establishment has a known history of illegal activities on their platform/premises there’s a case that can be built against them.

    That said, the internet is not a bad, and as a globally accessible platform with no physical presence validating ID and policing users/content can be quite difficult. Hell, we see that here on Lemmy with a not insignificant number of people who engage in illicit activities or troll .

    mayoi ,

    Lol no, there’s literally nothing I can do to you to force you to do anything, not even to admit that your stupid opinion is nonsense.

    Sir_Kevin , avatar

    This is a failure of parenting. WTF is an 11 year old doing on Omegle?

    sunbeam60 , (edited )

    It just isn’t that simple. I’ve got four kids. At least one of them ended up watching a naked man on Omegle once. And I say this because they were in a group of friends and dared each other on, on a school trip, and they were discovered (one of them felt pretty shocked and told a teacher) and we had a big discussion with her.

    Kids do dumb shit all the time. Omegle is (was) very much known about amongst them all.

    So, even with careful parenting and a locked down internet, and policies not to have phones upstairs in your room, kids do dumb shit or find a new service that isn’t in your filter, because they’ve heard about it through their friends. I know because my wife and I carefully raise four kids and the internet is a fucking onslaught to a dopamine dependent, approval seeking teenager.

    I’m not saying “it’s all Omegle’s fault”. Everyone had a role to play. But let’s not pretend Omegle was blameless.

    vermyndax ,

    You can parent your children all day long and everything is just fine at home. As soon as your kids are unleashed into the world of school, it’s anything goes. Your child is immediately subjected to all the poor and awful parenting that is outside your control. The only thing you can do is give them skills to navigate those situations. Sounds like @sunbeam60 did just that. Bravo.

    mayoi ,

    What a load of nonsense. My parents raised me right and I was disassociating from deviants from practically day one in school. Being subject to that awful parenting in other families only made me understand my own parents better.

    mayoi ,

    Careful parenting? Everyone had a role to play?

    A naked old man had to teach your kid something that you didn’t. I never saw a naked old man online and my parents didn’t limit internet at all.

    kambusha ,

    I guess you were never invited to the lemonparty then.

    mayoi ,

    I don’t follow random links, that’s like common sense.

    Jakeroxs , (edited )

    Counterpoint, I clicked on many random links, and saw many things I probably “shouldn’t have” as a kid/teen, still turned out alright I think.

    Even on Omegle in particular, after like one day, you gotta expect the dicks and move on lol

    I frequented 4chan at age 13-16 so saw pretty much everything one could see on the Internet.

    I’m not going to argue it was good or bad, but it’s not like it permanently fucked me up to the point of not being able to function as an adult later in life.

    There’s also the privacy vs protection argument here, if sites require verification that you’re over 18 or w/e that then means you have to provide some sort of identification, what happens if that site is hacked? Or bad actors use that information to blackmail you in some fashion.

    It’s a hard situation and I don’t know what the right answer truly is.

    mayoi ,

    The right answer is to treat teenagers like beta testers for adulthood and let them have some autonomy when it comes to these things but only a pedophile would think like this or something.

    Still, war games don’t make killers, why would 4chan make antisocial loser? Just as an example. I think it’s other way around, antisocial losers get exposed to 4chan the most.

    This whole “x will fuck you up” thing never made sense to me. If truth makes things stop working then things never worked. It’s normal to feel sick from watching a gore video, but there’s something wrong with your life if it can “ruin” your life.

    The way your parents raise you for first years of your life till you have something that can be called a personality basically defines everything you will do afterwards and blaming anything else just seems stupid to me.

    afraid_of_zombies ,

    110th comment in 8 hours.

    mayoi ,

    Keep us posted on things noone cares about.

    Seasoned_Greetings ,

    If you didn’t care, would you have responded to that? But do pretend that you don’t. Gotta maintain that infallible facade after all

    mayoi ,

    It’s free.

    Seasoned_Greetings ,

    Time is money. And you sure spend a lot of it here

    mayoi ,

    You have to be poor to care about this.

    Seasoned_Greetings ,

    Or maybe I’m sitting in a mansion bored out of my mind. Guess you’ll never know

    mayoi ,

    Now that you said it, I already know.

    Seasoned_Greetings ,

    Ooo woow, self important troll reads minds now. So edgy, he thinks I’m poor

    mayoi ,

    he thinks I’m X

    I wonder how did the troll know what I think.

    Seasoned_Greetings ,

    Oh ho, I can’t believe it’s taken you this long to try the reversal and call me the troll! Someone is learning a little. I’m so proud of you.

    You know, the funniest bit of all this is that the app I’m using puts a little baby face next to your name because your account is so young

    mayoi ,

    I’m sure this is contributing a lot to Technology.

    Seasoned_Greetings ,

    The contributing stopped when you tried to argue against tolerance on a post literally about the paradox of tolerance. That was about 60 comments ago, bro.

    mayoi ,

    Tolerance? Is that new type of technology?

    Seasoned_Greetings ,

    Playing dumb doesn’t suit you. You’re better than that

    mayoi ,

    You didn’t answer my question.

    Seasoned_Greetings ,

    You don’t answer mine either. We’re past those kinds of rules, given that you made it abundantly clear that you don’t abide a social contract.

    You’re a troll. Why engage any more than it’s an advantage for me?

    mayoi ,

    Not Technology.

    Seasoned_Greetings ,

    Different words, same stonewall. Not original. Try again

    Jakeroxs ,

    Oh Lord what happened here

    Seasoned_Greetings ,

    Just agitating a troll. Don’t mind me

    Seasoned_Greetings ,

    Actually, for an honest answer, this guy’s post history is incredible for an account that’s just 9 hours old. He’s a condescending loser with a lot to say when it makes him feel superior.

    We had an argument earlier about tolerance and the social contract, and he made it very clear that he exists to spite tolerant people specifically.

    And then I realized how hard he tries to win arguments (that he claims he’s never argued!) and how quickly he deflects when he’s losing them. So I decided to see how far it goes.

    He’s honestly quite fascinating. Might be the most prolific troll I’ve ever met.

    Seasoned_Greetings ,

    My man is a machine. I hopped on board at about comment 60 after a pointless argument where he insists tolerant people are bad.

    He might be the most prolific troll I’ve personally seen. I just want to see if he burns out

    Seasoned_Greetings ,

    Hot take, this guy had a great childhood so he expects every single parent to hover over their kids so that they don’t see something they aren’t supposed to. Oh, and if it’s an accident that’s still your failure as a parent.

    Man, this is an awful take.

    mayoi ,

    So true, I totally wrote that I expect parents to hover over their kids despite writing complete opposite.

    Seasoned_Greetings ,

    Nice, defend yourself to me. I have no stake in this argument but you still feel compelled to prove yourself.


    Rediphile ,

    It’s almost like we should focus on educating them about how to responsibly use the Internet instead of trying to censor their access to it (which as you pointed out, basically never works).

    Does anyone actually think shutting down one specific website will make a meaningful difference? Like… really? Did shutting down Napster stop piracy? Did shutting down Silk Road stop online drug sales?

    mayoi ,

    Trolling. You have no idea what schemes kids can invent when they’re not raised like infantile retards. A 11 year old should know to be wary of random strangers it’s like 6 years too late for that even. What they do with this is honestly their problem. I’m not too sure, but I don’t believe that I was the only kid on this planet that didn’t know that telling your home address online is stupid.

    capital ,

    What kind of conditions does a kid have to be in at home to feel like they can’t turn to their parent/guardian for help in a terrifying situation like that?

    Or… close the tab?

    Draedron ,

    Or click unmatch

    mayoi ,

    I was in special condition where it was common sense to not trust or even lie to strangers. Some groomers would ask my address and I’d give them address of local FBI office.

    Jamie , avatar

    But how the hell are they saying “forced” to do something by some scumbag over the internet?

    There was a group from Brazil doing stuff like that and got publicized when they were arrested recently. Usually they’d coerce the minor into sending one picture, then use it as blackmail against them to give them more. They might even gaslight them to convince them that they’ll get in big trouble if they tell anyone and it’ll just get worse for them.

    I’ve seen full fledged adults taken hard by scammers and willingly giving them thousands of dollars against their own interests, and they heavily distrust and resist anyone trying to help them. I can only imagine accomplishing that with a child that lacks long term thinking skills is even more effective.

    Jakeroxs ,

    Literally a black mirror episode

    adrian783 ,

    children are incredibly easy to influence. “if you don’t do it I will find where you live and harm your family, and do not call the cops/tell your parents” is often enough threat.

    pewgar_seemsimandroid ,

    what if the children play Roblox and are aware of the existence of pedos, they will be more careful right?

    phx ,

    The common thing I’ve seen in more well -knowncases was the abuser striking up a relationship and pretending to be somebody younger, getting compromising details/photos from the victim, then threatening to release those to family/friends unless the victim follows their wishes (which often providing further sexual images/acts).

    Not sure if that might be the case with a service like Omegle, but it was essentially what happened in the Amanda Todd case and other similar cases.

    ZzyzxRoad ,

    God, this entire comment section is nothing but

    “I’m not victim blaming, but…”

    “personal responsibility”

    “parents should be doing blah blah blah…no, I don’t have kids.”

    The best parents in the world still can’t control what their kids are doing every second of every day. Kids will always find ways around every single thing that’s meant to restrict what they can do, see, or hear. I’m sure you never did stuff you weren’t supposed to when you were a kid…right?

    richieadler ,

    Thank you for adding just another reason for the myriad of pre-existing ones that convinced me of never having kids.

    JTskulk ,

    I’ll do it then, I am victim-blaming. An 11 year old broke the rules and logged onto a website that she shouldn’t be on and then somehow a 30 year old guy forced her to take naked pictures. The problem wasn’t the website, it’s this child that broke the rules and doesn’t know not to do things for strangers on the internet.

    mplewis , avatar

    Dude, the victim is literally a child.

    JTskulk ,

    Hence why it’s easy to understand that she made this mistake. Her parents might as well sue the ISP for enabling this communication to take place.

    whoisearth ,

    An 11 year old child should be expected to break rules and at times end up where they aren’t supposed to be. 30 year old fucking predators shouldn’t be taking advantage of that.

    This is like shaming a 20 year old for dressing in a gogo skirt, raping her, and then saying “she was asking for it”.

    No. She wasn’t the problem. Your depraved ass was.

    Men are fucking pigs and I don’t trust the lot of you.

    Source: me. A man and a father.

    Rediphile ,

    Sure, but shutting down the website is like shutting down the club that the slutty 20 year old dressed up slutty for and went to on the night a creep raped her. Maybe she had a fake ID (if USA at least). And yeah, perhaps the club should be more careful about fake IDs. But the club didn’t rape anyone, the rapist did. And shutting down club A for club B to replace it will do nothing to prevent future rapes.

    whoisearth ,

    No offense to the good people in Omegle but let’s be real, that site like many other of these “anonymous chat” sites are rife with people like that dude. If a website can’t better control the traffic then shut it down. A night club has a bouncer and to your point can check and ID and fake or not I highly doubt an 11 year old is getting in.

    Shutting down the site is a small price to pay to protect youth doing what youth are made to do which is test limits.

    Rediphile ,

    Yeah, and we could shut down the Internet all together… or we could be realistic about prevention.

    And yes, I accessed lots of ‘sensitive’ material online as a kid well before this website existed. So I find it hard to blame this specific website…websites come and go. I do however absolutely blame the creep himself since they are the one who did something wrong. Not the website.


    Chat Roulette, the site Omegle copied the video format from, had a built in report option that would ban nude people.