usernamesAreTricky

@usernamesAreTricky@lemmy.ml

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usernamesAreTricky ,

It's not zero evidence, it's just not 100% certain. There have had known H5N1 infections in other mammals consuming raw milk that spilled. Many of them have died from it. Additionally, the testing that has happened shows that 1 in 5 US dairy samples are positive for H5N1 so it's prevelence is rather high making there be a very real risk

usernamesAreTricky ,

It's worth noting whatever's left is often still not enough to survive the winter. They often replace it with a form of sugar water that doesn't give the bees what they need

From a study looking at the harms of this replacement:

However, the amount
of HMF that can be found in homemade syrups, which increases with temperature and acidity, can be much higher
and can cause significant bee mortality. Moreover, we highlighted the detrimental effect of syrups acidity on
honeybee survival, suggesting that the addition of lemon or any other acidifying substance to invert the sucrose
could be harmful and not necessary.

https://link.springer.com/content/pdf/10.1007/s13592-020-00745-6.pdf

From a less scientific source but talking about practices more broadly:

To harvest the honey, beekeepers either smoke the bees to subdue them, or trap them with a clearing board over one or two days. Others kill the colony altogether.

Oftentimes, beekeepers replace the honey they remove with a sugar water substitute. This practice prompts honeybees to overwork themselves to replace the missing honey. Meanwhile, the sugar water lacks the nutrients, fats, and vitamins that bees need to be healthy.

https://plantbasednews.org/culture/ethics/is-honey-vegan-the-not-so-sweet-truth/

usernamesAreTricky ,

The paper shows its funding source The paper was published by authors from universities funded by government grants

The research leading to these results was funded by the European Union Seventh Framework Programme (FP7/2007-2013), under Grant 613960 (SMARTBEES) and by the Dipartimento diScienze AgroAlimentari, Ambientali e Animali, University of Udine, Italy.


Here another talking about the sugar water use and harm if you don't trust the first

The immune system is one of the animals’ most expensive physiological systems to maintain, especially when food is deficient in proteins [2,11,12], which is extremely frequent in commercially kept colonies, usually fed on sugar syrup

And for author information:

Funding

The study was supported by the Eastern Apicultural Society of North America (grant awarded to E.T.), and by the Ministry of Education, Science and Technological Development of the Republic of Serbia (Grant No III46002 awarded to the project led by Zoran Stanimirovic). The funders had no role in study design, data collection and analysis, decision to publish, or preparation of the manuscript.

Acknowledgments

Authors are thankful to the beekeepers from West Serbia (Sjenica, Prijepolje, Tutin, Raška, Novi Pazar and Priboj) for allowing the access to their honey bee colonies

Conflicts of Interest

The authors declare no conflict of interest.

https://www.mdpi.com/2075-4450/11/5/266

usernamesAreTricky OP , (edited )

All plant-based foods, whole-foods or not, have lower emissions than animal products

EDIT with a source:

Transitioning to plant-based diets (PBDs) has the potential to reduce diet-related land use by 76%, diet-related greenhouse gas emissions by 49%, eutrophication by 49%, and green and blue water use by 21% and 14%, respectively, whilst garnering substantial health co-benefits

[...]

Plant-based foods have a significantly smaller footprint on the environment than animal-based foods. Even the least sustainable vegetables and cereals cause less environmental harm than the lowest impact meat and dairy products [9].

https://www.mdpi.com/2072-6643/14/8/1614/htm

usernamesAreTricky ,

It is not well defined. Because an order of summation is not given you could just as easily sum pairs of (0,1), (-1,2), (-2,3), (-3,4)... (-x, x+1) and conclude you are constantly adding 1 to your total so it goes to infinity instead

Or do the reverse of (-1,0), (-2,1), ... (-x-1, x) and get that the each pair adds -1 so the sum goes to negative Infinity

Order of the addition sometimes changes infinite sums. Infinitely large things are weird sometimes

usernamesAreTricky ,

According to series animator Vincent Waller, "there is absolutely no meat in the Krabby Patty. There's no animal product in there", something which was always planned by series creator Stephen Hillenburg.[9]

...

he stated that there is no meat served in Bikini Bottom except at the Chum Bucket.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Krabby_Patty

usernamesAreTricky ,

Luckily neither are required for garlic bread if you make it vegan

For just one recipe
https://www.noracooks.com/vegan-garlic-bread/

usernamesAreTricky ,

Definitional retreat – changing the meaning of a word when an objection is raised.[22] Often paired with moving the goalposts (see below), as when an argument is challenged using a common definition of a term in the argument, and the arguer presents a different definition of the term and thereby demands different evidence to debunk the argument.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_fallacies

Argument to moderation (Latin: argumentum ad temperantiam)—also known as the false compromise, argument from middle ground, fallacy of gray, middle ground fallacy, or golden mean fallacy[1]—is the fallacy that the truth is always in the middle of two opposites.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Argument_to_moderation

usernamesAreTricky ,

Redefining the counterfactual scenario. Why ignore the case of less beef production out of hand? Beef consumption has been declining over time in a number of countries. Then proceed to ignore the rest of the article's main point after that one word

Beef is an enormous outlier in emissions and they are pointing out that the claims that supposedly reduce it are highly missleading. They're not much of a reduction. People tout it as if the emissions were gone. They're nowhere near that

usernamesAreTricky ,

This is all missing the point. People are claiming it's carbon free or low emission when it is still substantially higher than other things. The beef industry loves to promote this as if it solves beef emissions. It does not. The emissions are still very much there. If it was touted as a small reduction that would be one thing

usernamesAreTricky ,

That's the ideal case, but in practice much of it is directly derived from natural gas instead of electrolysis

In 2022 less than 1% of hydrogen production was low-carbon.[1] Fossil fuels are the dominant source of hydrogen, for example by steam reforming of natural gas.[2]

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hydrogen_production

usernamesAreTricky ,

The very first thing they talk about is grapples and how they're no longer sold. Then they recreating it by looking at the instructions in the patent for it from the company once making grapples

usernamesAreTricky OP ,

Yep, for a source for others about the plastic bit

The system that strips off the plastic wrappings can’t capture it all, and so in the UK a limit of 0.15% of plastic is allowed by the Food Standards Agency. The official EU level for plastic permitted in animal feed is zero although in reality many other countries operate within the same 0.15% limit.

https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2018/dec/15/legal-plastic-content-in-animal-feed-could-harm-human-health-experts-warn

usernamesAreTricky OP ,

I mean it still should still be horrfying, just that it should something to be worried about globally rather than just locally

usernamesAreTricky OP ,

Even thousands of years ago, it still involved great expense to the environment.
Human arrivals on continents coincides with extinctions of megafauna

https://ourworldindata.org/quaternary-megafauna-extinction

usernamesAreTricky ,

I assume this is probably not in good faith, but answering anyway for a reminder to others

From just trump and the US alone:

There was the child sepeation policy

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trump_administration_family_separation_policy

His appointments to the Supreme Court has led to abortion being banned in 14 different states across the US

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/ng-interactive/2023/nov/10/state-abortion-laws-us

Gender affirming care is now much restricted in a number of US states with constant threats at larger bans of all care

And so much more

In the UK, the right wing government has helped o underfund the NHS and make service worse

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2024/mar/04/nhs-funding-faces-biggest-real-terms-cuts-since-1970s-warns-ifs

There's a lot of damage that can be done. Just because it may not be as visible to one person, doesn't mean it does not exist

usernamesAreTricky ,

To be fair, from a quick glance, a good chunck of those articles are about ChatGPT/other AI and showing output from it as examples in the text

Though there are certain many that are not related to AI that show up in the results.....

usernamesAreTricky ,

We value your privacy....

You may click to consent to our and our 747 partners’ processing for such purposes

.... don't know if I feel like entering any information on that site

usernamesAreTricky ,

It's been there for a while, just hard to spot. From doing a binary search with web.archive.org, it seems it was added on October 5th, 2016 https://web.archive.org/web/20161005090723/http://xkcd.com/

usernamesAreTricky ,

Not OP, but the second paragraph on the article gives you an overview of findings

In this randomized clinical trial of 22 healthy, adult, identical twin pairs, those consuming a healthy vegan diet showed significantly improved low-density lipoprotein cholesterol concentration, fasting insulin level, and weight loss compared with twins consuming a healthy omnivorous diet.

usernamesAreTricky OP ,

There is not really strong evidence of plant sentience. Here's one paper looking at it:

A. Plants do not show proactive behavior.

B. Classical learning does not indicate consciousness, so reports of such learning in plants are irrelevant.

C. The considerable differences between the electrical signals in plants and the animal nervous system speak against a functional equivalence. Unlike in animals, the action potentials of plants have many physiological roles that involve Ca2+ signaling and osmotic control; and plants’ variable potentials have properties that preclude any conscious perception of wounding as pain.

D. In plants, no evidence exists of reciprocal (recurrent) electrical signaling for integrating information, which is a prerequisite for consciousness.

E. Most proponents of plant consciousness also say that all cells are conscious, a speculative theory plagued with counterevidence.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8052213/

Though something interesting and perhaps counter intuitive to note is that even if we realized plants were sentient, a plant-based diet actually involved killing fewer plants due to the lessened need to grow feed (of which most of the energy is lost)

usernamesAreTricky OP ,

Academic writing is usually dry, but every once in a while you run into something like that which changes your perspective on how to roast an idea

usernamesAreTricky OP ,

It's not perfect, but I think that statement is rather misleading. Problems with plant agriculture are multiplied by animal agriculture which relies on it even more to grow crops for feed. Counterintuitively plant-based diets use fewer crops and less cropland compared to animal agriculture due to not loosing energy from feed crops going to creatures who use that energy on their own body function

usernamesAreTricky OP ,

It's worth noting 77% of the world's soy goes to animal feed. Only 5% of soy goes to soy bean products like tofu, soy milk, etc.

https://ourworldindata.org/soy

usernamesAreTricky , (edited )

Haha, luckily wasn't too bad because it only nicked my finger for a really short amount of time. It rotated past my finger when it flicked around. Could have been much worse

usernamesAreTricky ,

There already is momentum in the right direction in many countries such as Germany. I don't think it's a hopeless fight at all

In 2011, Germans ate 138 pounds of meat each year. Today, it’s 121 pounds — a 12.3 percent decline. And much of that decline took place in the last few years, a time period when grocery sales of plant-based food nearly doubled.

https://www.vox.com/future-perfect/23273338/germany-less-meat-plant-based-vegan-vegetarian-flexitarian

usernamesAreTricky , (edited )

I would hazard saying "environmentally effective" here unless we are willing to ignore some of the other large environmental issues with meat production outside of just green house gases emission. Plant-based foods are lower not just on GHG emissions, but water usage, land usage, eutrophication, fertilizer usage^1^, etc.

There's all kinds of other pollutants such as Nitrogen runoff. The rise of the pig farming is has helped fueled a crisis in Nitrogen runoff in the Netherlands for instance

There's the high level of antibiotic usage to maintaining the high levels of production fueling antibiotic resistance.

And so on.

If we do want to look at the suffering, we should also note that chicken farming does not just keep things the same, but actually makes it worse with more chickens required than other creatures due to their smaller size.

^1^ Even less synthetic fertilizer even compared to the maximal usage of manure per https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S0921344922006528

EDIT: I should also mention that land use change (deforestation) factor can change as you rapidly increase these industries size. Deforestation makes up a large portion of beef's current emissions. Plant-based foods require overall less cropland due to not needing to grow any feed and removing that energy loss. This is not the case for chicken production. Currently beef does make up the majority of Amazonian deforestation, however, the second largest portion is growing animal feed primary for chickens. Switch from beef to chickens and you might risk just moving around where the deforestation comes from

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